…And You Expect This To Change My Mind, Why?
Irradiated by LabRat
So long as I’m ranting about gender issues, I’ve noticed a very weird and somewhat annoying phenomenon over the course of my career arguing on the internet. To wit: I will be arguing about some kind of cultural issue, and a male commenter will inform me that he would never date a girl/woman who (insert trait, opinion, or habit of mine here), clearly with the intention that I will take this as a warning that I am scaring off “quality” guys (read: guys like him, the two concepts are interchangeable) and that this will somehow influence my opinions, habits, or whatever. Otherwise, there would be no reason to bring it up in a conversation that was in no way related to dating Male Commenter Sumgye.
What. The. Fuck? Why on earth do they do this? Not only am I married, and happily so, the guys in question never know if I’m young or old or even straight, because the subject at hand is never actually dating. For that matter, WHY would anyone assume announcing that he wouldn’t find me attractive because his values severely conflict with mine (or his aesthetic tastes conflict with my choice of clothing and/or body type) would actually upset or influence me in any way? Even if I WERE single and looking, he just basically announced that I therefore wouldn’t want to date him either. Even better is getting told I’m what’s wrong with “American women” and that’s why he won’t date us anymore; believe me, Mr. Mail-Order Misogynist, I’m clicking my heels for fucking joy that there is no situation in which I would ever have to deal with your interest.
I stopped caring about whether or not I had to change some aspect of myself so “boys” would like me when I was a fucking teenager. I started caring about hanging out with people that liked the way I already am and shared enough of my values that disagreements were minor and friendly, and since college I’ve never really been short of them. (Though being married to a guy I met in college has kind of restricted actually trying any others on, so to speak.) I’m hardly alone in this; the majority of women out there have managed to interact with the rest of the other half of the human race successfully enough that their choices aren’t limited to “scumbags and losers” versus “men who disapprove of her”. So why the hell does this behavior persist to the point of repeated attempts to use it as a persuasion tactic in arguments totally unrelated to finding mates? Do women do this to men too and I just haven’t been on the irritating end of it?
Does this even work as an actual pickup? “You know, if you changed some things about you, I might possibly find you sufficiently attractive to have lunch with.” OH BABY THAT’S HOT. TAKE ME NOW.
February 8th, 2010 at 7:04 pm
I totally would never date a chick who rants about guys who say they would never date a chick who….
errr. lol. In my youth, I discovered many ways to get rejected by women, but that was all before the internet know-it-all-troll was invented.
February 8th, 2010 at 7:04 pm
+1
Especially when they say “you’re far too independent for my tastes.”
Which tells me you’re far too controlling for mine, thanks for playing, don’t let the door hitcha where the good lord splitcha.
Also the age-old “must be on the rag” joke. Sure, hormones and what can be blinding abdominal pain can make me fairly cranky but what does that have to do with my disagreeing with you? If I say in a non-joking way that you’re wrong because you have a penis and all penis-wielding people are wrong, then you might be able to assume that it has something to do with “female problems.” But until and unless I pull out my tampon and rub my menstruation on you, don’t assume I’m on the rag just because you’re acting like a moron and I call you on it.
February 8th, 2010 at 7:16 pm
Women do it too, but usually not to the guy’s face unless they’re just sick and tired of said dude and trying to get rid of him. Most gals I know tend to be a bit more polite and considerate when it comes to starting up or avoiding starting up a relationship.
Oh and FarmGirl, I’ll make you a deal. I won’t accuse you of being on the rag if you promise not to rub your menstruation on me. Please?
February 8th, 2010 at 7:19 pm
LabRat, you’re a right funny broad, you know that?
February 8th, 2010 at 7:24 pm
What Jay said.
February 8th, 2010 at 7:25 pm
Were I less of a misanthrope, this is where I’d try to apologize for the brain-melting levels of stupidity exhibited by my fellow males.
Being delightfully free of any such compunction, I’ll just point to Sturgeon’s Law, allow for how that applies to people in spades, and leave it at that.
The only advice I can offer is this: When some cretin starts making comments about whether or not you’d make a suitable mate, or if your current mental state has to do with whether or not you’re menstruating, it’s completely acceptable to start accusing him of having a small penis and issues with erectile dysfunction.
February 8th, 2010 at 7:26 pm
IME (at least outside of the internet) these also tend to be the same guys that vastly overestimate their physical attractiveness to the opposite sex.
The type that even if they were willing to do anything I say – I’d just say no.
February 8th, 2010 at 7:28 pm
A-fucking-men.
February 8th, 2010 at 7:46 pm
I’m gonna start a LafRat fanpage on FB.
February 8th, 2010 at 7:51 pm
Dammit. LabRat, not LafRat.
…sigh
February 8th, 2010 at 7:55 pm
What’s the problem, SmartDogs? Not attracted to overweight, socially inept men who live in a trailer and post from an @aol.com account?
February 8th, 2010 at 7:56 pm
Only gmail for me baby
February 8th, 2010 at 8:33 pm
Snerk …
These would be the same ‘tards who accuse me of being a black Democrat queer for telling them that they are useless bigots?
Dear ghod … I don’t want you on my side, either politically or gender-ally.
I wish they would give in to their latent homosexuality … they would be better off, and they might actually learn some social skills.
February 8th, 2010 at 9:27 pm
Great info! Thanks for informing us… keep it coming. I’ve been using Ciallis, luckily I don’t encounter any problems with it. I strictly stick with my doctors advice – NO nitrates meds. You can see drug info of this pill at http://www.medsheaven.com/index.html
February 8th, 2010 at 9:29 pm
Somebody just HAD to mention erectile dysfunction…..
February 8th, 2010 at 10:08 pm
Oh. My. Gawd. John baby – I want you NOW!
February 8th, 2010 at 10:28 pm
Well now I can’t delete the spam.
February 9th, 2010 at 12:26 am
>> Do women do this to men too and I just haven’t been on the irritating end of it?
Afraid so.
Oh, and please don’t go apologising, mediageek. The guys like me who haven’t done anything wrong get annoyed because an apology implies we need to be guilty anyway, the guys who do actually pull this sort of nonsense aren’t regretful, and I’m assuming guys like you who would mean the apology sincerely haven’t committed any offense either.
February 9th, 2010 at 12:53 am
Good one LabRat, I’m with Alan on this one!!!
February 9th, 2010 at 6:29 am
alan needs to hurry up with that fan page.
February 9th, 2010 at 7:08 am
A former (and now long deceased) neighbor summed it up perfectly: “Some men think the world revolves around their penis.”
Personally, I only let a woman know I wouldn’t be interested in dating her if she’s actually showing signs of wanting to date me. Being a middle-aged, overweight, and happily married guy who wasn’t that attractive when I was young and in shape means I don’t often have to go there, thankfully.
February 9th, 2010 at 7:14 am
>> Do women do this to men too and I just haven’t been on the irritating end of it?<<
Yes. Most are more subtle than men, and confine what they do to the people they are already partnered with. But being a self-absorbed jerk knows no gender lines. I've been informed of my faults and how I should improve in order to be date worthy in EXCRUCIATING detail. I'm an ornery cuss, and don't change. I'm also single, and damn glad of it.
February 9th, 2010 at 7:38 am
A former (and now long deceased) neighbor summed it up perfectly: “Some men think the world revolves around their penis.”
“We’ve secretly replaced this man’s penis with a quantum black hole. Let’s see if he notices…”
February 9th, 2010 at 7:40 am
Excellent post LR. If there is one thing the intarwebz have made abundantly clear it is that the education system has pretty much failed to teach basic reasoning in the past 30 years, yet has managed to produce lots of people who think that attacking someone’s self esteem (no matter how pathetically) to make them back down is the same as being correct.
Just for fun, next time a troll says that, you should private message back that you are actually really interested in them and are sad that they think that way, and perhaps you could get to know each other better. String them along for a few months, posting the logs up on your site for us all to laugh at as you build them up then eviscerate them with the grace and ferocity of a hungry puma. It is sort of the pagan blood sacrifice of our times, though that might just be my public education speaking
February 9th, 2010 at 8:19 am
I think that this should be called the “reject her before she notices what an asshole you are” defense.
These guys know that there is no way that you (or any other quality woman) would go out with them and therefore offer up excuses as to why you’re not good enough for them first.
February 9th, 2010 at 9:29 am
This classic comes to mind.
February 9th, 2010 at 11:14 am
Expired photo link, BobG. Maybe you could fish the image out of your cache if you can still see it.
February 9th, 2010 at 11:22 am
—->”Do women do this to men too and I just haven’t been on the irritating end of it?”
Women can do this, but not many do. It really comes down to the gender difference in approaching relationships. *
Men look for the perfect woman, then expect her to stay that way forever.
Women look for a fixer-upper, someone who is basically good, but needs her help to be the best man in the world. Women will pass on the perfect guy because there is nothing she can fix, and because she is suspicious that a man that good is hiding something horrible.
*Broad generalizations! Age and experience tend to “mellow” both sexes.
February 9th, 2010 at 12:06 pm
“Even better is getting told I’m what’s wrong with “American women” and that’s why he won’t date us anymore; believe me, Mr. Mail-Order Misogynist, I’m clicking my heels for fucking joy that there is no situation in which I would ever have to deal with your interest.”
Definitely not keyboard safe. {smooches}
February 9th, 2010 at 1:08 pm
mediageek,
“Were I less of a misanthrope, this is where I’d try to apologize for the brain-melting levels of stupidity exhibited by my fellow males.”
Don’t worry about it; you won’t find many collectivists here. The only person anyone ever needs to apologize for is his or her self.
February 9th, 2010 at 3:39 pm
Try this link, instead.
February 9th, 2010 at 3:44 pm
Chiming in with the fact that women do this too. It’s a personal attack, to be sure, and not really cricket. Men tend to say “I wouldn’t dater you”, and women tend to say stuff like “That’s why no one would date you” or “That’s why you don’t get dates” or somethign to that effect. It’s pretty common.
Personally, I figure there’s no point in announcing something like that, it’s almost certainly mutual, and probably obvious.
February 9th, 2010 at 4:21 pm
These are the same guys who feel it necessary to pick out the flaws of any woman in sight to whatever group of other guys they can get to listen. Unless they have free beer or are a boss of some type they only hang out with similar people in their mom’s basement.
February 9th, 2010 at 8:45 pm
One one hand, yes, it can be an intentional attempt at dismissing the other as inferior/unworthy. And in my experience, it gets dished out by both genders in varying flavors.
On the other hand, depending on the context, it could be intended as a statement of a strongly held personal boundary. In essence declaring that a given trait is a “deal-breaker” precluding a meaningful relationship. (Not simply romantic.) For example, if person A has a tendency to generate some sort of crisis or stress amongst their friends. Let’s say person B is utterly disgusted by such behavior. Person B declaring that they’d never be involved with Person A would not necessarily be intended as an insult or slight.
That said, I believe the circumstances you outlined would be more of the former than the latter. Long live the awesome Labrat.