Please Stop Representing Me
Irradiated by LabRat
The Freedom From Religion Foundation: always looking to create a positive image of atheists.
What, specifically, have they done? Having faced down the threat to democracy that is the Washington Capitol’s nativity display, they have installed a placard that apparently includes a lengthy message- because Lack of God knows, the longer and more complicated the message, the more it will stick- which includes the phrase: “”There is only our natural world. Religion is but myth and superstition that hardens hearts and enslaves minds.”"
Isn’t that special. Explaining the stated goals of this, we have Dan Barker, co-president, who elaborates:
“Our members want equal time… Not to muscle, not to coerce, but just to have a place at the table.”
Is THAT what that is. You know, the funny thing about the other displays was that they carried a distinct lack of spitting in the eye at anybody. The menorah is a simple display of light in darkness, with a nice symbolic value at a couple of levels. The nativity display is a celebration of, essentially, the birth of hope and redemption. (Followed and surrounded in the story by a lot of murder, but that tends to be the way these things go.) The atheist placard? “Fuck these other stupid savages, and if you were feeling hopeful and bright, fuck you too, it’s a cold dark winter out there.”
Granted, I don’t know what the rest of the message said. But does it even matter? Unless you already not only agree with the quoted sentiment, but carry with you that very special kind of smugness and entitlement to believe that it is not enough for other people not to force you to join in their belief and treacherous, spiteful good will, but to be insulated from all exposure to points of view you find backwards and barbaric- which is roughly the only attitude that can possibly be behind such a notion as “freedom from religion”- then whatever else it says, it reads “fuck you!”
Look. I think the separation of church and state is incredibly important, as much for the integrity of churches as for the integrity of the state- although looking at history, the state seems to be a rather more corrosive force than churches do. The state has a unity of interest in power over the people- churches tend to spend as much time subdividing and schisming over matters of principle as it does in trying to lead people around. When you give the state absolute moral authority without any sort of God, as in officially-atheistic forms of totalitarianism, the result seems to be really rather similar to what happens when you give the state absolute moral authority ostensibly from God- leading to the conclusion that in the term theocracy, the last half of the word is more important than the first.
But as far as conflations of church and state go, putting up a symbolic display or displays of the dominant faith or faiths strikes me as about as threatening as as the prospect of a coming military coup by the Salvation Army. Let religious folks have their symbols of faith and.. how’s it go… “peace on earth and goodwill towards men”. Yes, I KNOW it doesn’t always or even usually work out that way, but speaking of the Salvation Army, I’d expect those things from them much more readily than I would from Freedom From Religion. They’re not hurting you. (Unless you’re a vampire. Are you?) Attacking these harmless symbols only convinces the religious that what you’re really attacking are the things they symbolize to them- not a good hard smiting of the unbeliever, but compassion, charity, good will, and hope for the best in humanity.
Do all of us infidels a favor- you know us, the least-trusted minority in America- and sit down, be quiet, and SMILE when someone wishes you a Merry Christmas or Chappy Chanukah or Reverent Ramadan or Krazy Kwanzaa or whatever generic sentiment that assumes you view the winter season as anything other than a yearly astrological event. They are wishing you good will- the smart thing to do is take it, and return it.
It’s in short enough supply as it is no matter what flavor it comes in.
December 1st, 2008 at 8:58 pm
Amen.
December 1st, 2008 at 8:59 pm
…and a joyous Yuletide to all!
Seriously, right on.
December 1st, 2008 at 10:17 pm
Merry Christmas!!
December 1st, 2008 at 11:12 pm
To anyone who INSISTS on freedom FROM religion, I have a very simple answer “Go fuck yourself”.
Perhaps, as a practicing catholic, I should sue to force the government to ensure me freedom from athesists, anti-theists, and apostates too?
Freedom OF religion means no-one can force you into or OUT OF a religion. You, and everyone else, have that right.
Freedom of conscience is one of the three fundamental freedoms (they are conscience, self determination, and property).
You have no right to prevent anyone else from practicing their religion freely however; even if you don’t like it, or it offends you.
It amazes me how those who most vigorously preach “tolerance” are the most intolerant.
Of course I know this doesn’t apply to you two. It’s the worst of the anti-theists; who are more proselytizing than the worst of the evangelicals.
December 1st, 2008 at 11:35 pm
I just don’t understand this sort of atheist. I used to, back in my teenage years, when I had such a desperate need to feel that my beliefs were the only right ones, and that I had to aggressively defend them by attacking anyone and anything Different. I can’t fit into that mindset anymore. And the thing is, the more you grow, the more you learn that there almost always is something in the opposing point of view which you can take with you, and understand, and grow from, religion even moreso than other things. Whether a religious belief is right or wrong isn’t the question. The question is whether it can make people better, whether we can find something good in it. For a lot of people, that answer is yes. What possible reason could I have to destroy something that gives hope to others, without something just as good to replace it?
The message they put up should have been different. Instead of making a Statement, aggressively defending themselves, they should have gone with the spirit of the moment, the intent of the occasion. The universe is majestic and beautiful, in all its glory. Isn’t it a hopeful message to say that this wonder can happen by accident, and then to think of what we could create if we set out to change the world deliberately? Instead, they said that the universe is cold, dark and uncaring. This is not the way to make people listen to and think about your position. It’s just a way to scare those too weak to defend themselves.
December 2nd, 2008 at 12:03 am
What a load of passive-aggressive bullshit. Between the belligerent message on the placard and the cringing, whining, I’m-more-victimized-than-thou “we just want a place at the table” rhetoric, Freedom From Religion ought to have alienated (first) anyone they were trying to convert and (second) any mildly sympathetic atheists looking for strong, confident representation. Fuck ‘em.
December 2nd, 2008 at 8:20 am
Odious of O & P and I used to refer to THAT kind of atheist, when they were campaigning to be known as “brights”, as “smugs”.
Merry Christmas!
December 2nd, 2008 at 8:31 am
“It will be two-sided, with a lengthy message on the main side, ”
Sure, that’s great. The Jews put up a fancy candle, the Christians are showing a still from a story.
The atheists’ display? A ‘lengthy message.’ Sounds like a holiday winner!
I wonder if the Freedom From Religion group would back getting rid of the end-of-year holidays.
“and “Keep State/Church Separate” on the back. Barker said that step is necessary because critics have sometimes spun around the group’s other statehouse display, in Wisconsin, in hopes of hiding its message.”
Perhaps people were just tired of being harangued, or tired of being bored to tears by “a lengthy message.”
December 2nd, 2008 at 9:03 am
A message of “the world is just awesome, happy winter!” would do much more for their cause. Sadly, that would require respect for other people.
December 2nd, 2008 at 10:01 am
I’m an atheist, but I agree wholly with your sentiments.
December 2nd, 2008 at 1:24 pm
I’m in complete agreement with you; just because I don’t believe in a religion is no reason to push my disbelief at others. Too many atheists act like religious extremists and get obnoxious about it.
Someone who is beating innocent people over the head with Origin of the Species is no different than one who beats you over the head with the Bible.
Just my opinion.
December 2nd, 2008 at 5:02 pm
evangelicism sux no matter how you dress it up
or down, as the case may be
December 2nd, 2008 at 7:02 pm
I wonder why the second part of this phrase is so hard to understand.
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof
December 2nd, 2008 at 9:23 pm
Dylan Bruns: A message of “the world is just awesome, happy winter!” would do much more for their cause. Sadly, that would require respect for other people.
Is it just me, or is the Discovery Channel’s “The World Is Just Awesome” commercial as good as it gets for nontheistic season’s greetings?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PK00DMcDygs
December 2nd, 2008 at 10:57 pm
Blunt- That would get the atheists lynched even harder for getting boom-de-ah-dah stuck in everybody’s head again.
December 3rd, 2008 at 3:54 am
I’m exactly with you.
December 3rd, 2008 at 5:05 pm
[...] at Atomic Nerds isn’t a fan: Do all of us infidels a favor — you know us, the least-trusted minority [...]
December 5th, 2008 at 4:26 pm
This guy makes a good point
http://secularright.org/wordpress/?p=498
December 5th, 2008 at 4:36 pm
Yup, he does. It’s like I’ve said in the past- it IS a Judeo-Christian culture just because Western history is so steeped in it, and for humans, elements of culture aren’t modular, they’re complicit.
Plus I just can’t see the point in getting upset about it. Some folks apparently really do, but fer Pete’s sake, nobody’s chasing you with holly and a cross.
December 8th, 2008 at 11:06 am
Conservative Christians React to Atheist Holiday Sign
Go over there and give him hell.
December 10th, 2008 at 9:55 am
I think the best display the Freedom From Religion group could have made (and still kept the message) was nothing more than a blank piece of poster board with a card claiming it.
It makes the point without offense.
December 15th, 2008 at 10:46 pm
What a hand-wringing bunch of punching bags there are on this site.
Get the point. Government buildings, and politicians, are forbade by the constitution from using the state to push any particular religion, or religion generally at the expense of non-religion. Christians bring this on themselves, by insisting on these asinine displays in the first place, and that’s the whole point of this display.
Apparently most of the people commenting here are quite content to remain second-class citizens, as long as the religious bigots don’t pick on them. I can’t imagine wanting to live my entire life like a bullied ninth-grader, and that’s why what FRFF did, whether you like it or not, is a good thing.
December 15th, 2008 at 11:18 pm
Oh noes! Their well-wishes made my butt hurt a lot! That tree burns my sensitive godless skin like fire ’cause it’s all religiousified! A whole bunch of “hey can we have a week or two where we don’t all openly hate each other?” knotted my panties up so much that the cleaners charged me extra and it’s all god’s fault!
Yeah, totally second class here. Look at me, denied all those rights like the vote, free speech, arms, etc. Wait, son of a bitch! I still got all them! Nobody told me! Noooo booodeeeee told meeeee!
Nobody here is wandering around like a bullied 9th grader. At least one commenter, however, is wandering around like Dylan Kliebold. Chill out. Have some dip. You will not burst into flame if you’re within six feet of an opinion you disagree with.